Let me disabuse your minds a little bit and let me propound one question–what is really the core issue in this elections? Is it the eradication of graft and corruption, as what Noynoy Aquino is saying, or the prioritization of anti-poverty programs, like what Manny Villar is indicating in his ads. Some people blame poverty for the corruption while others see corruption as the leading cause of poverty. Yet, this is far from being the chicken and the egg debate.
Poverty and corruption are both real and states of one’s mind. If you’re poor, you feel it. If you’re corrupt, or somebody is, you sense it. Both concepts are states of mind. You might have a few bucks in your pocket and say you’re poorer than the other guy beside you. You might have seen somebody holding a fist-full of cash and want them for your own. Or, you’re a government employee receiving tax payments and desired in your heart to get it to pay the tuition fee of your kid.
Villar is probably correct when he sees poverty as a leading cause of corruption, yet, he is probably wrong when he concludes that it is the only cause of the nation’s misery. It is noteworthy to eradicate the reality of poverty but that will not be the end of it. If people continue to be misery in their ethical or moral behavior, then, poverty will never be eradicated.
Aquino stands firm that graft and corruption leads to poverty and he cited numerous figures to support his claim. Yet, even though he successfully ends corruption in government, poverty as both real and a state of mind will continue to exist because Aquino presents no concrete program to end it.
I think what lies and probably, THE most important issue in this elections is the fortitude of the Nation’s spirit. Poverty and corruption are emanations of a weakening and sickly National Spirit. They are like boils that appear in our Nation’s Id. The most important issue is how to actually strengthen the National Spirit so that people will not feel poor and they will not see the need to do corruptive acts. If Filipinos have high morale, then, they will not feel hopeless and feel poor. If people have emotional attachments or linkages with their government and trust their government enough, they will not commit grave acts of corruption and promote graft.
Like what I wrote in http://pinoyobserver.com, the next six years will be about re-construction and democratization of damaged institutions. It will not be about eradicating poverty nor completely cleansing the bureaucracy of graft and corruption.
The next President will have his hands full, modernizing our old and decrepit democratic institutions and re-imagining how government works more efficiently and more effectively in servicing the people. Without, however, a re-strengthening of the martial Spirit of the Nation, these efforts will all be put to naught because people will still feel hopeless and poor and corrupt.
The next six years should be about re-instilling pure Filipino nationalism and strengthening the very institutions to reflect the National Spirit. There should only be one message and that is, unity under a democratic regime peopled by individuals who believe that change can happen and it will happen. Whoever has the wherewithal to exercise leadership will be the one respected by the People and admired to lead this country out of chaos and national disaster.
Popularity: 2% [?]
This sounds a lot like the social capital agenda. Social capital or some would say restoring a sense of civic consciousness, trust and a concern for the community, as opposed to the atomised Homo Economicus or Invisible Hand.
The notion that people are too busy in their day to day struggles and are indifferent to the state of affairs is indeed something that has not caught on in the campaign. But increasing a sense of civic pride and duty and allowing the electorate to feel a sense of empowerment by giving them a stake in the system would indeed help reduce corruption. (And the link between social capital and economic well-being has also been established by prior empirical studies.)
The key question would be how to operationalise this policy agenda? Greater parent participation in school boards? Community based governance of shared natural resources and health initiatives? Improving finance for agrarian reform communities? Increased local autonomy? Group-based micro-finance? There is just a plethora of options which the campaigns have yet to touch on in detail. I agree, there is more to it than just anti-corruption or anti-poverty.
Stop moralizing and allow animal spirits to bloom. Life is unfair and only when enough people have the means to balance exploitation and oppression will balance ensue.
Enough of this nonsense of causality.
“The next six years should be about re-instilling pure Filipino nationalism and strengthening the very institutions to reflect the National Spirit.”
I couldn’t disagree more. The next six years should be about rebuilding the social infrastructure so that individuals can aspire, achieve, and grow prosperous. End closed and biased courts, end nepotistic hiring, stop the nonsense that gets in the way of individuals building careers. The last thing needed is to get more closed in some nationalistic cocoon. Rather, open the country up to foreign investment, engagement, and citizenship. Let the incompetent get kicked aside by the skilled and competitive. Build a thriving economy, not a closed one. The only people who would be afraid of this are people who believe Filipinos cannot compete against others.
Joe
Good one, Patricio!
Indeed, we urgently need to re-invigorate the National Spirit. But since we don’t have a one-party system and instead have this very vibrant, runaway democracy (read as chaotic), I doubt if we could make progress.
To initiate the national efforts in this direction, the next leader must have a charismatic approach and clear mandate, that is a UNANIMOUS DECISION by the people with more than fifty percent of the votes. Looking at the surveys, I guess it will be a SPLIT DECISION again.
Tsk tsk, todas na naman ang pangarap natin, Mangubat.
Phil Manila,
What do you mean by “National Spirit”? I think there is too much obsession with being Filipino, and what that means . . . Edsa, not Edsa, colony, not colony, yay Paquaio and Charice . . . and the nation is fundamentally closed off to foreign ideas, competition, and that vibrant “we’ll take the best of any nation” spirit that has driven American innovation, competitiveness and success from the Getgo. Rah rah Philippines gets you nothing. It is Wowowee in a flag. DOING things gets you places.
Joe
Bringing confidence and self-worth to the Filipino will be a heroic achievement.
An heroic.
I am trying to brain storm what “NATIONAL SPIRIT” best describe…!
I could only think of three words. That’s if we…[...]
SURGE-THE-GATE
I am voting Phil Manila, to lead this “Charismatic Movement.” Dakila!
I’ve tried using my “national spirit” when I had to deal with:
Traffic Enforcers
Barangay Officials
PNP
LTO
BIR
Customs
My local “munincipyo”
BID
SEC
But it didn’t work. I still had to pay off the monkeys who work for the agencies listed above.
that’s not ‘national spirit’, that’s called bribery.
Yes it is. Joe’s comment below explains why;
” You don’t get anywhere without battling thieves or paying bribes” – Joe America
We need witches to appeal to the national spirit- witches education bureau with a vision of “render as you command and take no more than what is truly yours” I can be a witch who maintains faith in God and affirms that flying broomsticks are imaginary but would be nice “at rush hour” lol
“If people have emotional attachments or linkages with their government and trust their government enough, they will not commit grave acts of corruption and promote graft.”-Pat
Pat, this looks like a chicken and egg statement.
First, the people must have trust in the government, but…
First, the government must not be corrupt…
Then the people will trust government…
Then the government will not commit grave acts of corruption…
Hehehehe.
“Villar is probably correct when he sees poverty as a leading cause of corruption.” – Pat
I though the leading cause of corruption that leads to poverty is wealth. The reason: under normal circumstances, the poor cannot capture the State. The wealthy can, to make the State serve their interests, not the poor’s.
I see poverty as a symptom of the disease, where the disease is “no way to go forward except by cheating”, because the empowered have sealed off all avenues of individual expression and “self-realization”, and the poor are too bogged down in subsistence to do anything about it. I reckon that leaves the “guilty” of corruption to be the middle class, which could do something about it, but does not.
Joe
erratum: “corruption is a symptom of the disease” . . . old brain . . .
I mean “I THOUGHT . . .
.
The leading cause` of corruption is not poverty. It is greed. Otherwise, there will be no corrupt politicians and corporate executives in world class economies where the poor are put to welfare by the government.
Cat,
The leading cause of corruption is that there is no way to get ahead, except by cheating. Corruption is the symptom, lack of real opportunity the disease. Wanting food on the table is not greed. Wanting to support the family is not greed.
Joe
joe,
Also, there is a passage to “Corruption”, “C5″…!
Joe,
You are correct when you say wanting food on the table is not greed, wanting to support the family is not greed. But want is not the determining factor here, how one meets the want is what really matters.
And then of course when is enough enough, when is their enough food on the table, when is support sufficient? Greed would come into play there.
tama ka dyan Cat. The cause of corruption is greed not poverty. It says something about Villar that he is unable to identify the cause of corruption, doesn’t it?
mb,
there is no such thing as enough. give people some 100,000 and they will crave for more. give them millions and they will not stop asking for more.
Greed will come into play even when there is not enough food because there is another deadly sin–envy.
Poor people become greedy out of survival instinct; rich people become greedy because of the desire to acquire more than they already possess.
Anybody who has had experience and has had to come across with SOP in government dealings understands that it is a team effort. Put forth from the lowest rank-and-file bureaucrat and the booty shared all the way to the top henchman. So corruption appears endemic and ingrained in the entire system.
If so then the motives of corruption are legion. For the lowly government bureaucrat it could be to help make both ends meet. For the tenured government official maybe because of greed, or simply to recover monies “advanced” to get an envied position.
For others, simply because it is now part of the system, and like it says, standard operating procedure (SOP). So in this instance a nefarious motive may be secondary.
Simply put, corruption in this complicated context could be the result of a host of reasons, and extensive poverty being an ugly reality in the country for many could be a most pressing motive.
Or what about that as a people we Filipinos are not too particular about breaking laws, whether legal or moral? Look around, examples abound about us – from the small to the large, from the petty to the serious.
pat, if you run on the abstract platform of national spirit, you will only get the votes of philosophers, may of them sitting in the arm chair. or blogging.
“…you will only get the votes of philosophers, may of them sitting in the arm chair. or blogging.”
LOL! And of course, our ideologue will be one successful rotisserie chicken entrepreneur that you know who. :-)
My concept of the national spirit for change is like this: the problem of poverty and corruption is so much prevalent and embedded in the country, solving the inter-twined issues will require a macro, visioning-type of experiment.
I believe ‘In our small way’ efforts will not simply do it, mates. That’s why the need for CHARISMA and UNANIMOUS MANDATE to kick start the national effort.
Hmmm, sounds familiar, no?
Not poverty per se but income inequality is what leads to corruption through the “capture” of state agencies. The Philippines was richer than Korea and Taiwan in the 1950s, but had a greater concentration of wealth because it failed to implement land reform successfully unlike the two East Asian countries. We all know what followed…
The Cusp,
You can say income inequality is an effect of corruption but you cannot say it is a direct cause of corruption.
Corruption is a personal choice and as such personal qualities like greed come into play.
There are many who are poor who suffer from income inequality but who do not become crooks and cheats.
Actually manuel, over time you can say that initial conditions in the Philippines (the concentration of landholdings among caciques) led to a state that was captured. Compare that with the initial conditions in Korea and Taiwan in the 1950s where land reform was implemented which led to a developmental state, autonomous from vested interests. Of course in Korea the reconcentration of wealth under the chaebols led to greater corruption than in Taiwan. As in the US now where the finance industry’s large share of GDP led to their capture of regulation from Washington. Concentration of wealth leads to corruption is a thesis that has been proven.
(Btw These are not my original thoughts. A PhD candidate from Stanford presented a paper before the PolSci Association in the US that showed just that.)
Agree! simple LAND REFORM.
how simple can it get? The answer is already staring us right at the face and people here distort and deviate.
Money from corruption is not intended to put food on the table. The corrupt people are not the isang-kahig-isang-tuka government servants or rank and file employees of corporations which subsist on corrupting third world governments. They are more sophisticated individuals who can think of ways by which they can cheat and hide their modus operandi. Ever heard of how people from Enron down to some contractors of FEMA made use of self-designed accounting system to rip off the public and government.
The money from corruption goes to the vice and luxury that the corrupt would like to enjoy. It is not for basic items.
Even the uniformed police have to earn extra for their second families.
Instead of regarding it as a symptom of poverty, I rather think of it as a symptom of system that allows the corruption possible.
Even a very religious person would be tempted to dip in the purse of an organization if it is easy to access the funds.
You are referring to the “greed plus discretion” hypothesis that the IMF/WB uses in order to promote their anti-corruption programs, which cost a lot but have nothing to show for. Before that they tried to reduce the size of the state through privatisation. It again did not work.
Corruption is a symptom of a weak state. The state is weak relative to powerful business lobbies and interests. They became powerful relative to the majority because they had amassed wealth and could organise easily, while the masses were dispersed and disorganised.
The irony here is that most Western countries have done away with corruption by legalising and regulating what used to be illegal transactions between big business and their political parties.
Like calling influence peddling as lobbying? Calling gratuity for bribe? And facilitating fee or fast tracking fee for faster results?
Cat,
Even among the corrupt there is a saying, “Hindi ko ipampapakain sa pamilya ko ang perang kinita ko sa ganitong paraan.” Of course very few crooks practice what they preach but the fact that the saying exists means something
Cat,
Much of the so-called evidence that links low corruption to economic growth just is not there according to Mushtaq Khan. China the fastest growing nation on earth is also a highly corrupt one according to the Corruption Perception Index. But, it has found a way to protect the rights of investors with a unique institution called Town and Village Enterprises. They haven’t applied the “greed plus discretion” paradigm to grow, instead they have developed their own local institutions. We have yet to do the same.
“Villar is probably correct when he sees poverty as a leading cause of corruption.” – Pat
Villar has a point. He grew up a poor man in Tondo. If only he grew up rich in Forbes Park like PGMA then maybe the C-5 road extension might will be a straight line.
I beg to disagree.
IF Davide is the proponent of C-5 extension, it WILL be a straight line.
bert,
pilyo ka talaga. GMA couldn’t walk the straight and narrow even if her life depended on it.
National Spirit? What’s that? Nakakain ba yan?
How can national spirit take precedence over the eradication of corruption and poverty?
I’d rather be a colony of some benevolent nation (theoretically) than go hungry and live in a corrupt environment.
National Spirit my pwet. Nationalism is an ambiguous concept, a relic of the past that deserves to be discarded.
actually, you simply can’t. the irony of globalization is that there are actually more separatist movements resulting from it, in search of establishing their own identities (think quebec in canada, or catalonia in spain). ang pinoy lang naman talaga ang global citizens, kasi nga nagsi-alisan dahil sa talamak na korupsyon. this pretty much sounds like the diasporic experience of koreans in the 70s; now that they’ve reconverged back into their homeland, mas lalo na sila naging nationalista.
Nationalism in the face of corruption is like whistling into a typhoon . . .
I think there is a misunderstanding as to what corruption in the Philippines means. It is not just the ZTE scandal or rigging WTO construction bids or re-routing expressways to for private benefit. It is dynamite fishing, scales that are rigged to favor the vendor, cheating foreigners on prices, LTO staff taking payments to process licenses without exams, and the thousands of transactions that take place daily that are cheating or outright theft.
Cheating is an ethic in the Philippines, as anyone who has tried to buy land, get title, and build a house, or sue for annulment, knows. You don’t get anywhere without battling thieves or paying bribes.
Corruption is a symptom of the disease, it is not the disease. The disease is that the nation provides no opportunity for people to get ahead honestly.
There are progressive societies and there are societies such as the Philippines that make it impossible for individuals to thrive and produce. Avenues of justice are closed, allowing unfair or corrupt practices to thrive. Friends, family, and favorites are hired and promoted, plugging up the best career channels, stealing opportunity from the capable, and filling the nation’s important jobs with mediocre people. Schools teach by rote, and that it is good to obey; they don’t teach independence and entrepreneurial spirit and how to compete and be a confident, accomplished achiever. Millions of babies are dumped into the economy each year, growing up and suffocating the job market in such enormous quantities that wages are driven to rock bottom.
Corruption is not just bad acts by a few in power. It is the social framework, the national ethic. It is the only way to get ahead, given all the barriers to honest achievement.
To become a progressive nation, the Philippines must change its social infrastructure to provide honest opportunity to earnest, capable workers.
Joe
i don’t think it’s a national ethic.
it’s overpopulation.
in sustainable populations like Batanes, you still see honesty boxes. as you go further into the overpopulated urban areas, it’s dog eat dog.
thenashman,
Yes, too many people, too few jobs is one way that opportunity is blocked. But the lack of court access is a structural failing, too. So is nepotistic hiring. But I agree to your main point, overpopulation is a big deal. Putting that cat back in the bag, however, will get you clawed . . .
Joe
Joe,
I know what you’re talking about. It is difficult to stay honest in this country. But honest people exist in this country despite the difficulty they face. It is from them that I draw strength and the inspiration not to join the ranks of the weak and the cynical.
mb,
Yes, good point. My generalization certainly unfairly sweeps up good people and mispaints them. And I agree that holding to high principles is self-inspiring. That so many people are FORCED into subscribing to other principles is the great tragedy. You have a real job, neh? And I have a real pension. So we have advantages.
Now the super-crooks like those WITH good jobs here, I truly can’t figure out their motivations . . . seems a tad sick to me.
Joe
Excellent points, Joe. And that’s why generating economic growth, while providing social programs to help marginalized groups, is critical. That growth will strengthen the middle class, which will have greater agency. In the US, I’m more of a Democrat than a Republican precisely because I believe redistribution is just as important as growth itself. So, while I think Villar and Gibo might successfully generate wealth, I have serious doubts about how progressive the social change under them will be and suspect that wealth will remain concentrated in the upper and upper-middle classes.
Just because Villar comes from the poor doesn’t mean he will actually help them. With Gibo, it’s even more of a concern, given his family background and ideological persuasions. Certainly not much radical change can be expected with both, given Washington Consensus/Chicago School modes of thinking, that’s for sure. Both appear to have no problems with monopolies (Danding, etc). Both also appear to have few misgivings about increased foreign ownership of Philippine companies (charter change, etc). Noynoy at least has stood up to Danding, does not want charter change and is for reviewing the VFA; among the major candidates, he also has the most progressive stance on the RH bill. Gibo has allied himself with corrupt figures like Danding and GMA; Villar happens to be one himself. If the only things against Noynoy r his family name (and inheritance, which includes a minor stake in Luisita; I gather he plans to address the “massacre” head-on pretty soon), his legislative record (which is pretty progressive in terms of what he has chosen to endorse and support) and his softer stance on the RH bill, I’d be willing to take my chances on his being the most genuine force for social change among the major contenders.
Lila,
I agree that Mr. Aquino is the most highly principled candidates, and a lot of the mud slung his way is rather like that deceitful partisan political mud slung about in the US. I find myself rationalizing Mr. Villar, however. That he did not really steal. He just fudged around the edges to get highly rich. And if he can double the economy because, face it, he is a good operator, whereas Mr. Aquino can only bump it up a little, because he is not as self-directed, then Mr. Villar has earned any riches he fudges over to himself. Rather like those obscene CEO salaries in the US.
Joe
Maybe this can help define things:
http://atmidfield.com/2010/02/16/coming-soon-the-aquino-villar-debate/
Noynoy may be good in theory but in practice, this guy is plainly basic. There’s no traces of accomplishment nor active participation in his part except when needed. He has an entitlement mentality from the history of his parents. I really think Noynoy will set this country backward. The monopolistic ideas of the people around him is not good for the country. It’s time to open UP the economy.
I would like to have a one on one debate with Noynoy, anytime, anywhere.
Lila,
Please excuse my delay in responding further. I took the time to digest your commentary, which was rich with issues. You have an amazing mind and ability to connect relevant issues at what I presume to be a blazing typing speed.
My creaky cranium is a tad slower and my keyboard for some reason often misplaces or omits letters and entire words. I fully intend to write Dell Computers to complain about this problem (the keyboard, not the cranium).
Short form, bouncing off a few of your comments. Re: monopolies; I think the best way to deal with them is to give foreign skills and money access to the marketplace so domestic firms are forced to compete. Re: VFA; if the Philippine military were not so busy protecting the country against everyday Filipinos (manning COMELEC and other checkpoints), they could apply themselves in an orderly and forceful way to waging battle against terrorists and destruction-minded rebels without any American presence whatsoever; all the VFA does is gives American troops certain legal protections while they are (busy risking their lives) on foreign soil. Re: redistribution of wealth; the Philippines needs to create the wealth first by unlocking the ability of ordinary Filipinos to compete, achieve, and produce aforesaid wealth.
Joe
My turn to apologize, Joe. I didn’t see this until now.
Well, about monopolies, I always like to see who is funding whom. In the case of Chiz (and Loren), for example, I was wary because Danding was originally supporting them both. It would be impossible for them to break his monopolies if he had funded their campaigns, right? So, for all of Chiz’ talent and intelligence, he is regrettably tarnished in the eyes of many as a candidate who was willing to compromise with someone like Danding. The same applies to Gibo. If anything, Villar will entrench monopolies since that’s pretty much what his real estate schtick is all about.
Noynoy at least has not attempted to make nice to his uncle (at least as far as I know) just for the sake of getting some money.
But about foreign skills, etc, fair enough — that’s basic free market competition. Just remember, tho, that things won’t be evenly distributed among domestic firms.
Absolutely agree on the VFA and wealth distribution!
Mr. Villar is right. Poverty is the cause of corruption. Mr. Villar
stated he came from the poor. So, he has the right to be corrupt by
using his position to enrich himself thru the C-5 controversy.
Noynoy Aquino states graft and corruptiuon leads to poverty. I disagree
with him. He must pay his farmer laborers a fair share of their labors
in order for them not to live in poverty. He must not order goons to shoot them down. Or like her mother, Cory Aquino. Order the Police to shoot unarmed farmers demonstrating at Mendiola. To ask for fair share of their labors.
Graft and corrruption in the Philippines is no longer in the id or
subconcious of the Filipinos. It is in their Genes. Part of their DNA.
It will take many decades to remove these customs and traditions of Filipino politicians, and officials. The public office is a CASH COW.
The National Treasury is the main target of every Presidential hopeful.
I would recommend that we do what they do in Saudi Arabia on thieves. The Saudis cut the hands, fingers and arms of thieves. However, I fear we will become a people with amputated fingers, hands and arms.
Canuto,
Do the Saudis cut the tongues of people who spread lies about the dead?
They are not lies. They are the truth. We have been deluded
by the EDSAs. We are still living in a State of Delusion
of the Stolen Dream of the EDSA Revolution. Wake up, Dummy!
The item below is one the very few things where majority of Pinoys agree on.
————
Because three out of four Filipinos live in the rural areas, then onnecting
the rural areas to the world via broadband is absolutely imperative to build up
our whole economy. All Filipinos deserve the equal opportunity to enrich their lives
through the benefits of affordable broadband and other modern communication technologies.
———
Agreement on this one??? Probably not.
Congress should authorize the increase of per-text-message charges which
the telcos can spend for infrastructure at the less-profitable rural areas.
———
When it comes to opening their wallets, Pinoys in Pinas bicker.
The item below is one the few things where majority of Pinoys agree on (even bachelor- or bachelorette Filipinos who do not have children of their own).
————
EDUCATION is one of the linchpins towards a better life. Pinoys in
Pilipinas, though, face an educational crisis with the embarassingly high
percentage of citizens who start elementary school but do not complete even
6th-grade education, coupled with very poor infrastructure (school buildings,
books and other material, teacher-quality) which prevents even college-graduates
from having the skills to perform well in technical and other jobs. It benefits our
whole economy, and all Filipinos deserve the equal opportunity to enrich their lives
through the benefits of quality public education.
———
However, there will be disagreement on the sentence below.
Congress should raise taxes (increase in VAT; higher tax-rate on real-estate
capital gains and dividend payments) which the national government (and LGU’s)
can use to strengthen Pilipinas educational system.
The item below is one the very few things that many Pinoys agree on. There are probably many Pinoy high-school students who agree.
————–
There is so much corruption, so much nepotism. There are many hurdles to
personal achievement, there are so many “they’s” who are working to oppress me.
You are all saying it and I agree, it is impossible to progress. why even try?
This country has no spirit of accomplishment, no progressive spirit,
there is no hope.
Hindi pa ako nagsisimula ay talo na ako. Why even try? Bahala na ang diyos.
Corruption kills economies. Case in point is Greece and other Southern European countries where were greased palms are rampant (underground transactions is estimated to constitute 30% of the total economy and has now caused direct European Union to have oversight into the Greek fiscal policies which is a blow to the Greek nation. Greece is ranked 71 out of 180 in the transparency corruption index. The Phillipines is now ranked 139th. Corruption has to battled and eradicated if we want to progress. Having good clean business practices brings enormous economic advantage in attracting investment and confidence in our banking system why will help us weather recessions and other financial difficulties. I think education of the people on the far-reaching effects of bribery and corruption as well as more punitive measures should be done in the Phil. Even monkeys have been shown to have sense of injustice when they see it. So this psycopaths who have no empathy to our Filipino brothers should be “smacked down” as the monkeys do when they see something that upsets their innate sense of justice.
http://www.financialpost.com/story.html?id=2566929
http://www.transparency.org/policy_research/surveys_indices/cpi/2009
Amen.
China is ranked lower than the Philippines, yet it grows faster. Should we follow their lead then? The founder of the Corruption Perception Index has found that given a choice between corruption on a grand scale and petty corruption, investors actually opt for grand corruption. The reason being that they prefer the predictability of corruption that is centralised or coherent compared to the chaos of petty corruption.
The question now is that since we cannot completely eradicate corruption, which candidate offers us the least amount of damage to our economy? Villar would contend that he as a CEO of a major company can eliminate petty corruption, whereas Aquino who everyone regards as being honest might not be able to control the bureaucracy. The Philippines is already classified under the grandly corrupt profile. I guess a Villar presidency would only mean a continuity of the current state of affairs.
rosa,
I will say over and over that corruption is the symptom of the disease, not the disease itself. You can get rid of the symptom best by curing the disease, which is essentially lack of opportunity for people to get ahead honestly.
Included in the disease is ineffective courts and nepotistic hiring and too many people.
Joe
Poverty or corruption, each one feeds the other, and both need to be eradicated. Philippines is actually very rich what with potential oil revenues, mineral wealth, strategic location and a well educated workforce. What we need is to have ethical and disciplined leadership and an informed and vigilant electorate. If we lower the bar and accept the alibis of one who has already shown his greed, then just on the outset, we are already crippled and handicapped. What is stopping him from going after our oil wealth or signing deals that would favor him over the Juan de la Cruz as he has demonstrated he is capable of doing? The church,government, educators have to step up their campaign of saying no to corruption and campaign to have the guilty punished for deterrence. We should harness some of the OFW taxes to be spent on education and infrastructure with everything being transparent. BIR collection should be scrutinized and underground economy be monitored to increase tax revenue. Rules against discrimination and nepotism should be established at government HR offices. Level the playing field for local and international companies to increase investment. We should have a forum where the best minds of the country, here and overseas will meet to discuss how to lift the country out of this poverty, corruption, increase investment, investment opportunities for OFWs and similar topics, results of which can be shared with the government and the people. Unless everyone cooperate and act, we will be continually mired in poverty and shunned by the investment community.
rosa,
No no. Poverty is also a symptom, not the disease. The disease is lack of opportunity for people to excel. Dumping millions of babies into the job market is a part of the reason no one has a chance at a career.
It is important to see the problem in order to see the solution. You can’t cure corruption by jailing people. You can cure it by giving them careers, allowing foreign competition to force local firms to compete, slowing population growth, and opening the courts up and making them efficient and apolitical.
The economy has to accelerate to take care of poverty, and the number of babies dumped into the market has to decline. Babies are like the national debt, a future expense and burden.
Joe
You can’t cure corruption by jailing people.
Joe, I beg to dis-agree. Punitive measures are necessary if we want people to behave. How many times does my driving speed improve after I receive a speeding ticket? Or at least till I have another meeting I am running late for and I have to bite the bullet? Until we can invent an anti-corruption mental prod, we have to employ a deterrent means to curb it. I included the church since they are supposed to remind their flock about righteousness and what better venue to talk about it than during their weekly sermon. Also in classroom setting, the teachers can talk about honesty and integrity. I agree with all your measures to alleviate poverty especially about preventing overpopulation and improvements in the judicial system. Ordinary citizens have to learn to obey rules and face the consequences of their acts than resort to bribery. Sometimes I am thinking this is almost an impossible dream but other countries have been where we are and they have come a long long way and now are industrialized. I would love to read a research study if available on how Korea, Japan, Singapore and recently China achieved economic growth and any parallels to the Phil. situation.
Rosa,
Yes, you are right, of course. Certainly avid prosecution would help, starting from the top and working down, preferred. I think a stick and carrot approach would do the most, the stick being prosecution, the carrot being the things I mentioned aimed at making it easier for skilled people to build careers and prosper.
Joe
It is understandable that the investors opt for grand corruption. The country where corruption is high is ” investor friendly” in a sense that thy could easily get what they want. For example, borrowing their capital from the local financial system of the bank. Do people think that the investors bring money with them when they open businesses? Perhaps sunset technology but not the wads of money that we need.
ibig sabihin, ginigisa rin tayo sa sarili nating manteka.
The Cat,
Are you saying borrowing is corrupt? Whoa, Nellie, that is an offbase reading of a valuable capitalist tool that brings future benefit into the present.
Joe
I would be happy with any kind of investment-foreign or otherwise. The fact is (and I thank Ciel Habito for pointing this out) there is a lot of money floating around locally, but it is not being invested productively even by local players. Why? Perhaps they know something that foreign players don’t, and that is the petty corruption that weakens their incentives to invest.
Which goes back to Joe’s point. The public might come to tolerate corruption at the top, if it can guarantee predictability and ease of doing business down below. On the other hand, why does the MBC lopsidedly favor Aquino? Perhaps they know that it won’t be a “level playing field” if Villar gets elected. They can probably live with the current business rules that work in their favor. They most likely don’t want an “upstart” rocking the boat.
“There is a lot of money floating around locally, but it is not being invested productively even by local players.” – The Cusp
I have long thought that’s the fundamental cause of our underdevelopment, and impliedly, of poverty in the Philippines.
What’s probably needed is, are you ready for it . . . corruption (i.e., distortion) of the present system to put those money to work, including adopting such strategy as ending the level playing field by legalizing monopoly in certain targeted sectors or government entrepreneurship in others.
Experiment until we find whatever works in lieu of the failed norm but always be guided by, well, the “national spirit.”
Abe, That’s the thinking behind the maverick Dani Rodrik who says “let a thousand growth models bloom.” The use of rents as a tool to incentivise state sponsored industries was used by Korea and followed by China and Vietnam to grow their infant industries. They can/could do that because their bureaucrats have what is called “embedded autonomy” (they consult with big business but can wield the stick if the carrot fails).
The Philippines state can practice the embedded part, but not the autonomous part. That is why import substitution stalled after a decade of growth in the 50s. The state couldn’t discipline the underachievers. It’s not about picking winners, it’s about being able to stick it to the losers.
Cusp, I can see your point simply because in RP the private sector dominates the weak state, i.e., the bureaucracy.
The remedy then is to form a strong bureaucracy, drawing them essentially from unadulterated “greenhorns” but passionate for change. There are plenty of them according to MB who “do not become crooks and cheats” (I could even sense some are hanging around in FV).
Then create transparent performance measures (get every sector involved in designing the standards, meaning reps from government, business, academia, labor, civil society groups, and perhaps even from the church, and the military). This process is equally paramount. (Just watch for breach of WTO or similar commitments.)
Incentives (largess) should be withdrawn from the underachievers (the fairness principle).
Remember everything is essentially experimental. Try and try until you succeed.
The hard part here is how to persuade those whose resources will be at stake to join the experiment in the first place. That’s where “national spirit” is supposed to come in. The rub is if the spirit is wanting, then what?
We blog forever until a saintly Marcos comes up.
Perhaps, or we can simply strengthen the existing civil service. Appointing “greenhorns” even though they be passionate sounds a lot like bloating the number of presidential/political appointees – which is fine as long as they are qualified to be professional civil servants.
Providing a clear career path, promoting based on merit rather than patrimonialism and decompressing the salary scale by giving priority to managers next time you declare a pay increase would improve incentives, rather than relying on the managerialist scorecards which is problematic in the public sector to say the least.
Cusp, I should have emphasized “unadulterated” instead of greenhorns. But even as greenhorn, I’m referring not to the inexperienced but one who is “fresh,” or not otherwise hardened with the ways of the broken system.
I have in mind the Korean student activists which had rocked the country in the 60’s, but who turned their country around after university life as the corps of managers and technocrats that helped build South Korea.
Also, I’m not thinking of appointment as the selection process for those bureaucrats but, you are right, something akin to the system for career foreign service in place now or much tougher. So, that too will have to be designed.
Our population growth rate of >2% per year ensures we have a steady supply of greenhorns not yet broken by the system.
>Two percent is 2M new Filipinos every year. That’s a very deep talent pool.
Two million born every year… the number of available civil service jobs seems just about right, then, considering that:
…Dropout rates likewise remain significant and have persisted for more than four decades since the 1960s. Various studies cited in the report show that one in three children who enter the school system does not finish elementary education, while only less than half of those who enter high school manage to complete secondary education.
Only 15.3 percent of elementary schools scored 75 percent or higher level—75 percent being the required minimum competency for the next level of schooling— in the 2006 National Achievement Test (NAT). The situation is worse for high schools, where less than one percent made it past the 75 percent level in school year 2005-2006.
“Compared to the performance of Filipino pupils in science and math in the 1920s, which approximated that of American children, current day performance in these subjects is dismal,” said the PHDR.
…run like hell apparently. Pilipinas needs to raise taxes to pay for better teachers, better buildings and books, better classroom-attendance by students.
How are you going to raise taxes? From the unemployed?
Maybe we should encourage the migration of highly skilled and highly paid workers to our country.
The CBCP certainly has the brilliant idea of more Filipinos means more OFWs
Do you know the tax on two million pesos of dividends? Nope, not 32%. Hey, the Ayalas and the Lopezes know how to keep their taxes low, whatcha think?
Do you know the tax on three million pesos worth of OFW income? Yup! Zero. Same as the tax on the capital gains for real-estate profits when Ping Lacson or the Arroyos sell houses in California or New Jersey.
Assumptions on corruption generally fall under three classifications: demand theories, supply theories, and ethics theories. “The CAT ” explains well the supply side of corruption. The demand side is when corruption concern the misuse of power by a ruling government, or its many lower level to facilitate a transaction. Ethics-based theory is explained well by the “CUSP” and it can directly undermines the legitimacy of a candidate. Unethical corporate conduct can prevent free market activity. It’s monopolistic strategy can hurt our country.
In the Philippines, the demand side of corruption like those who extract illegitimate wealth from entrusted authorization has always been the target of media and worry citizens. Less attention has been placed,however, on the supply side – those who exercise crooked payments and undue influence to seek unlawful advantages.
Villar is an all around agent whereas Noynoy can be an inexperienced agent of corruption.
leytenian,
Corruption is the symptom, lack of opportunity to achieve honestly is the disease.
Barriers to achievement need to be eliminated and corruption will dwindle to an occasional itch. Barriers are: lack of justice through the courts, allowing unfair practices to subsist; hiring/promoting friends, family and favorites; overpopulation which dumps millions of bodies on the unemployment or underemployment rolls; an educational system that teaches “obey” rather than “produce”. And a few others, but you get the point.
I get tired of hearing people harangue about corruption. Get out, protest FOR something, like fair employment. I can’t imagine why young people put up with old fogies blocking their career aspirations by the fogies hiring their favorite incompetents, instead of people who can produce wealth.
Oh yeah,
go back to education system, that teaches “obey”.
Joe
Joe,
I am for punishment and reward This country rewards the dreadful and punishes the capable. There’s no room for an opportunity. Obey to produce should be the mission, the national spirit. Produce but forget to obey is like corruption, eh? hehe
“Villar is an all around agent whereas Noynoy can be an inexperienced agent of corruption.”
leytegirl, the former is a given, the latter speculation.
It’s not speculation but an assessment. Looking back at noynoys past performances, there’s really none that can support his ability. Why footsie footsie with mbc eh?
who’s mbc?
ah, a given vs. an assesment. a given is a given while an assesment is still speculation. no?
bert,
I will not argue with you. you have been so nice to me ever since i’m here at FV. So, I will respect your right to vote for Noynoy but if you really want me to use my broomsticks and whip your ass, I can do that too.. heheh
Bert,
Ethic based theory in corruption..
Corporations already possess free speech rights when it moves towards advancing their own interests. They have had it ever since there were corporations. The instrument by which this free speech is communicated is advertising directly or indirectly , like supporting a candidate. And there’s no legal limit on how much they can spend on ads or attending a forum just to advance its own interests.
My assessment, if advancing a corporation’s interests involves free speech in the form of outlay in cash money on campaign ads or support to a product, it is really just another form of product peddling. And if the product this time around happens to be a political candidate running for office, kawawa ang pinoy. (the exchange of goods for an agreed policymaking)
Leytegirl,
Did you whip my ass already? With what, with fussy and irrelevant theories which have nothing to do with the realities on the ground? The realities on the ground are that Nonoy and Villar are the top two contenders, with Gibo way below the ranking. You’re yourself is rooting for Gibo, and why are you rooting for Gibo? I can guess you’re not a GMA fan, but your candidate has the stain of all the problems, they’re one and the same, being parts of the rotten system and complicit in all its undertakings fair and foul. And here you are, critiquing the two personalities who have the most chances of making it to be president of the Republic after the election, one having the potential to minimize corruption and thievery in the government, the other the potential to abet them.
The presidency could not have been ‘contrived’ to be a ball game between a Noynoy and a Manny – one crushing endemic corruption and another looking at something else instead – prioritizing anti-poverty programs.
This does not make sense.
A lot of more well-meaning candidates come from the pack, they deserve as much right to be placed in the sample. Strangely enough, FV allows every form of ‘market-testing’ strategies under the guise of an intellectual discussion of issues.
Well, just to drive home the point.
This notion of a ‘national spirit’ steps into the void. The more it does not make sense to even speak about it as the single stumbling block to our nation’s survival. We do not have to reinvent the wheel, do we?
I did not say that borrowing is corruption. But when you invite foreign investments, it is expected that there will be capital inflow in the country.
When foreign investors partner with local businessmen, foreign investors bring in technology while the local tap the money in our own financial system. When the business goes bankrupt foreign investors lost their technology which are oftentimes close to being old and “scrappable”. The
local businessmen are left with huge debts.
When they cannot pay, the business is auctioned at a very minimal price.
Who lost? The Philippines whose money should have been spent more on the projects that could benefit the public.
No virgina, the behest loans did not stop when Marcos was ousted. There was only change in the names of the cronies/beneficiaries of the loans.
NPA’s for me do not mean New People Army, it is Non-Performing Assets which are sold ultimately to foreign banking institutions for a pittance amount.
That’s the way the market works, CAT, unless you want a centrally planned economy. Businesses either turn a profit or they go belly up. The fact that they close doesn’t relieve them of the obligations to pay back their loans though (unless there is a sovereign guarantee). The fact that they can borrow funds locally actually helps the local banking industry as well. We should be asking instead why did they fail? The worst possible answer is if they found the costs of doing business in the country too high.
The fact is that when these businesses closed shop and the debtors could not pay, the assets are foreclosed by the banks. And that is what is interesting. The assets are so overstated that when they are assessed for possible auction or sale, the book value would not even be enough to pay the liquidation expenses.
care to know what happens to the behest loans of the cronies of the government from marcos to to date?
Care to shop for foreclosed business that you get for a song if you know who and you know when and how much ?
You are talking of historical cases, and cases under a dictatorial regime when the state owned a number of the banks and where the allocation of capital did not follow the market principle. We are far far from that situation today. My point addresses the more general case, and that is, no one enters business to lose money intentionally.
The cost of doing business in the Philippines IS high.
Energy costs – very high. Labor costs – high.
Bottom-line : Filipino manufacturing productivity is low (compared to Singapore, China, Canada, Egypt, France), most recent evidence being Intel and other plants, FedEx and other operations that have closed shop in the Philippines.
Evidence : Pilipinas imports rice.
Let foreigners own the entire company and you won’t get half-assed efforts that fail. The only people who would object are those who believe Filipinos can’t compete with others, or those who gain by the Philippines being closed off (the entrenched oligarchs).
BongV, where are you when you can see how well I listen . . .?
Joe
LOL.
Your obviously still pushing for predatory/competitive ideals to support foreign business interests. And we wonder why America is always at war hehe. read: Weapons Sales.
I really don’t mind closing off the Philippines. We are a resource rich country. If only imperialists would be deported, we could be the next Vietnam.
Edward,
Vietnam has actually swung its doors wide open to foreign business since 1998. And it has beaten the Philippines since then in about 6/10 years in attracting Foreign Direct Investments. In 2007 alone it attracted $6.7B worth compared to our $2.9B. Some of silicon chip factories have actually moved from places like Cavite to Vietnam, laying off thousands of skilled workers and managers.
Nationalism doesn’t necessarily equate to protectionism or xenophobia, rather in this context it is about having a sense of civic consciousness, trust and a sense of solidarity with the community.
As for our being a resource rich nation, well there is such a thing as a “resource curse” or “Dutch disease” which afflicts countries that have misused the windfall from their extractive low-value add resources industries. Some say it leads to greater corruption as the temptation to pocket and splurge these tax revenues offshore becomes too great for the leaders of developing countries.
The Cusp,
Nice having your voice here.
Joe
True, I always learn from the Cusp comments. They very well reasoned and informative. Are you by chance an economist or at least a student of public policies?
“I find myself rationalizing Mr. Villar, however. That he did not really steal. He just fudged around the edges to get highly rich. And if he can double the economy because, face it, he is a good operator…”-JoeAm
Joe,
Pls. Gilbert Remulla’s Report on the C-5 controversy, and the Senate Committee of the Whole Report, then judge fairly, if you’re fair, which I believe you are, just to have a balance view of the whole thing.
I should insists that a pickpocket who is a good operator is a thief that will enrich himself but not his victim. Do you believe otherwise?
addendum: (Pls. read…)
Bert,
My problem is, I don’t know who to trust. Fundamentally, that is it. When there are so many thieves about, even in the Committee of the Whole, who do I listen to? Everyone is grinding their own personal axes and none seems to stand up to provide the kind of aboveboard civic service they were elected to provide.
And I have to concede Villar is a highly accomplished operator. Who else would be able to slip sideways past the condemnation represented by the Committee of the Whole so neatly, making the Committee the villains?
I’ll return your question with a couple of questions.
Who do you think will increase GDP more, Villar or Aquino?
By a little or a lot?
Joe
Joe,
As to the Committee of the Whole, it’s best to ignore the speeches and just to read the draft report which is available online. The evidence speaks for itself.
Joe,
I will rephrase your question to “What attracts investors and who will make the business environment more attractive to business?”
And the answer to your second question is – “GDP will increase in direct proportion to the trust level of investors in the leadership of the country.”
And so the question that would necessarily follow is “Who do you think will inspire more trust?”
MB,
Good point, for sure.
Joe
Damn right, Manuel. The damage of the C5 issue also has to do with the trust of investors (and the loss thereof). An entire BOT scheme was just laid to waste. Why would foreign funders and investors want to do business in such an obviously corrupt context? U can also look at it in terms of opportunity cost and potential loss of FDI.
When you enter a business, there is no guarantee that it will become profitable.
As far as I know the practice of front-ending the loans of the “friends ” the people in the administration by proposing a project with little or no collateral was still in practice after Marcos era. Some pocket the loan proceeds and invest just a small portion of the loans obtained from the SSS, GSIS and other banks.
Have you checked lately who have humungous debts and who are not Marcos cronies?
Do you know that GSIS pensioners were not given the right amount of pension or lump sum for their policy because there is not much enough money (they said that it is computer glitch)?
collateral, pocket the loan proceeds and invest a small fraction for
show. The funds financed capital flight and other investments.
Yes, CAT, you rightly point out that government still tries to dip its fingers into investments that it shouldn’t get involved in from a prudential management point of view. Anyway, let us hope that better governance rules can be enacted to ensure that people’s savings are properly invested. Btw the Brits find themselves in the same boat having sunk a lot of money in the Icelandic economy so it can happen either out of greed or just plain stupidity.
No nation has a monopoly on stupidity.
But the Philippines is trying hard to capture the market on untrustworthy.
Joe
Joe you troll :)
I think the Philippines is trying hard to capture the market from the U.S. and lost. The U.S. already got the Muslim market hehe.
Edward,
Ouch. Ouch.
Well, Patricio wrote his blog and abandoned us to our own devices so I thought I would do a bit of ranting. Felt good . . .
Joe
My My Dollar Joe you are treading on the margin of the reality of the societal format. The Philippines is still predominantly run along the lines of a family based ties. That is normal for a third world economy. This results in weak state institutions. Hence you can trust only family or filial ties. They call it a feudal format.
The Philippines has not graduated to the industrial value added regime of capitalism. We need the right kind of robber barons. To entice the wealthy into building railroads the U.S. guaranteed that lands along the route would be compensation for the builders of the the railroads. Create the wealth first and do not worry about competition policy. Certain sectors of the economy are natural monopolies. You move to the industrial value added regime and you will create the blue collar proletariat and the white collar proletariat.
These two classes in the philippines context do not yet exist.
It is also clear that Dollar Joe has a naive view of foreign investments. When individuals immigrate to the Philippines that is a plus for the country if they bring in their finance and resource capital. There is no future claim on the domestic economy that will be exported out. However all foreign investments into the country are in fact future claims against the domestic economy.
In point of fact heavily indebted countries and those that continually have fiscal deficits are those that always run chronic trade deficits. We are still to a large extent a carabao based food growing economy. It is no secret that science and engineering have multiplies the productivity of the same plot of land many many times over. That plus the fact that the U.S. is the largest fiscally united economy on this planet. There is almost 100% free trade, plus no restrictions on capital mobility and a totally decentralized labor migration policy within the U.S. Plus they have a unified singular monetary system. The Euro zone is not a fiscally united territory. National considerations still determine fiscal policy.
In the Philippines mostly amongst the so called educated ones there seems to be a monopoly of ignorance.
You cannot have state institutions that mostly work without providing the material means for those institutions. The general rule in the country is you can buy anyone even the President of this country.
And please do not use the term competitiveness loosely. The actual problem is actually two fold– Labor productivity and total factor productivity. A lot of people like to use the term (competitiveness) casually without understanding the import of the word.
J_AG,
And my naive economic view says that if the Philippine economy is robust, foreigners who invest here will never yank their claim out.
Joe
I think I am having a hard time getting across the notion that corruption and poverty are not, of themselves, the problem. The problem is bigger. You understand “book blockade”, right? This is a more pernicious and pervasive blockade.
Filipinos simply do not have the opportunity to aspire honestly toward prosperity.
Avenues of self-realization, ambition, and achievement are sealed off. The economy and job creation are stopped up by oligarchs who choose not to compete or invest and by a government that is sorely lacking in practicality. Plus millions of babies are thrown into an already weak job base like so much excess debt on the balance sheet, bogging down future opportunity. It is an employer’s market, in spades. Friends, family, and favorites are hired for key jobs, blocking career aspirations, putting mediocre people in important jobs, and providing the setting for corruption to flourish. People cannot access courts to end unfair practices.
Opportunity is blocked. Locked down. Dammed. Stifled. How many ways can I say it? Talented young Filipinos, especially, are getting the shaft. Blocked from the chance to use that talent in the Philippines. Might as well get your ticket for the US or Europe now . . .
You cannot solve corruption on a wish and a prayer. It is too widespread and ingrained in the national ethic. To cheat is to do what millions do, because it is the only way to get ahead. You can’t cry “stop” and have it stop. You can’t jail people, because you don’t have enough jails.
If you want to DO something about it, start advocating for a different social dynamic. Break down the blockade. Advocate FOR: (1) open, fair and expedient courts so those damaged by ill-gotten practices can get compensation and punitive awards, (2) a fair employment law that bans nepotistic hiring, that mother of all barriers to equal opportunity, (3) foreign ownership of businesses to break the choke-hold oligarchs have on the economy, (4) birth education, which has absolutely NOTHING to do with abortion, and (5) high school courses that teach career planning, individuality, and how to compete for success.
If I were a rabble rouser, I would raise my voice right here, and thrust a fist in the air. Actually, I probably did it a couple of paragraphs ago.
Stop bitching, whining and chasing the ghosts of corruption and poverty and solve the fricking problem at its core. End the great Philippine blockade of opportunity and initiative. Free Filipinos to aspire, compete, grow and prosper.
Talented Filipinos are blocked, sealed off, shut down. Squelched. Squashed. Promise erased. Potential zeroed out.
I don’t understand why young Filipinos are not absolutely livid about the rotten deal they are being given. Why do you settle for some yahoo oligarch’s COUSIN being jammed into YOUR rightful career path? Why isn’t the student body of every university in the land on the warpath about this?
Have Philippine schools been that successful in teaching “obey”? Millions of marching minions singing the national anthem blind to greatest theft of all time. The opportunity to excel.
Joe
you cannot achieve (1) and (2) because we are overpopulated. it just takes 1 out of 1,000,000* for the system to break down.
you can easily read the comments on FV and see that a lot of people are willing to make compromises when it is not needed, or have extremely low standards.
and there are even those FV commenters who currently live in first world countries but still have a third world mentality and continue to impose their mediocrity on the motherland.
(even if there is only 1 crooked in 1,000,000, that’s a 99.9999% honest society)
With regard to (1), I would suggest running a scorecard on the courts, number of cases, types of cases, resolution arrived at, and average time per case. I personally know one judge who held seven hearings on an annulment proceeding, representing about 10 hours of court time over an 18 month period, then arrived at a “no”, even though the husband beat and abandoned his wife and child. What a waste of judicial resources.
With regard to (2), I would suggest university students riot and demand equal right to a career, and end hiring of mediocre cousins and friends.
Joe
“… end hiring of mediocre cousins and friends”.
Hiring by whom? If the one hiring is “The Government” (the mayor, the congressman,
the Highways Department senior manager) that would be against civil service
rules. If the one hiring is the local head of a Makati bank branch, that is the problem
of that bank’s HR department. If the one hiring is the business owner, different story.
thenashman,
What makes you assume that our ways of thinking is as of the third world capacity. I am merely expressing my opinions on certain columns and, applying insights on some [issues]matter. It is my rights and, I have that same right as you do, for being opinionated on the subject being presented.
Having the privileged to move about into two wonderful Countries, such as the island I was born into, Philippines, is my foundation and my rock. As the great Nation as the United States of America, California gave me an opportunity that our own Nation could not give me. That is, OPPORTUNITIES. (plural)
Am I to be criticise for expressing my thoughts about my people, of course, at the same token, did I not opened their minds to my exasperated verbiages. For those individual who are agitated, I am not here on FV to rock your world, but to give my insights, as others do.
Immorality is the main issue. We have seen how the Nationalistic Spirit can be abused by ultranationalists which are making them blind of their mistakes. Sense of equality, generosity, charity, humility (not supporting lifestyles).
Nationalistic Spirit is needed of course when approaching the VFA (very fascist America), odious debt (by the World Bank), and lobbying of foreign interests (export labor).
ahahahaha, Edward,
wheeeoooooo hahahahahaha
Hehehe sorry Joe :D
I think I need to expound on the VFA fascist part being a unilateral agreement. It does speak of fascism doesn’t it? even Russia is against this kind of U.S. unilateralism. I’m not just going for the “death to America route” here hehe
Eddie,
heh
waiting for the next “Yankee go home!”
Joey
Hehe like in Vietnam?
The Philippines never faltered in it’s loyalty to the U.S. But abusing it is another thing. Maybe if the conditions are met, there will be another Yankee Go Home.
Joe, my friend,
You’re sounding more and more like the anti-pinoys, bashing my people and my country like a BongV virus. That’s what you get for missing him too much. Does your Biliran province giving you the El Nino?
Bert,
Joe is just opening the minds, reminding the Filipino’s to be aware of their own surroundings. Too many crooks, who will pick your pockets, when you have your head turn the other way.
It’s a painful reminder, when you do tell the truth…! Or, are you turning Anti-Pinoy on us Joe? LMAO
Mario,
Interesting reaction from Bert, as I thought I was passionately defending Filipino interests and agitating for specific ways to convert good intention (ambition) into progress. But maybe the Anti’s do, too.
If I flip my arguments and say that Bert is for the opposite, then I gather he favors corrupt, inefficient courts, nepotistic hiring as the basis for key hiring, birthing like rabbits, a closed economy ruled by oligarchs, and having high school education teach obedience but not accomplishment.
I’m way confused about that, but I suppose it does clear up why things don’t change for the better.
Joe
Joe, we can manage without foreign guests berating us in every thread in this forum, thank you. I am very sorry and very sad saying this to to you my friend, but I don’t want to be dragged into any cultural mudslinging with anyone or any nationality though I love sparring with the anti-pinoys who are my fellow Filipinos, my compatriots.
Bert,
I didn’t berate you.
I’m not slinging cultural mud, I’m giving an opinion.
You seem to be a bit of a hyper-nationalist bigot.
I have thought deeply about corruption and what it’s root sources are. I shared my thoughts.
If they offend you, when you see the photo of the old geezer named Joe America, just skip that part.
If they are wrong, tell me what is the right way to end corruption.
Or are you telling me it is fine? I’d accept that. Most people here adhere to that ethic.
Joe
“But the Philippines is trying hard to capture the market on untrustworthy.”
“When there are so many thieves about, even in the Committee of the Whole…”
.”Cheating is an ethic in the Philippines,…”
“Corruption is not just bad acts by a few in power. It is the social framework, the national ethic.”
Joe, above are your words in this thread alone. You’re not only berating us, you’re also slandering the senators of the Republic. Thank you, Joe, I am a bigot! For caring for my people.
Bert,
I dunno. I agree I use generalities to make a point sometimes, and they unfairly wrap the good with the bad. I suppose my perspective is shaded by the fact I have been ripped off so many times here. Everywhere. Government, people who are supposed to provide services, relatives who you would think could be trusted . . . every corner, every building, every transportation device, every business deal.
And I don’t like politicians who pretend to serve the public, but actually do quite another thing. That goes for US legislators, too, the biggest pack of civic deviants you can imagine.
Cheating IS an ethic here, at least from the perspective of someone who has grown up in a country where laws are roundly respected, and people tie their honor to good behavior.
Joe
You’re a gentle person Bert. I’ve seen how you deal with anti-pinoys in the past, and I think I should learn a thing or two from you.
Joe,
It’s not out of nationalistic pride here, the generalization reeks of anti-pinoy extereme. Their signature moves of provocation by generalization won’t change a thing here or anywhere (considering they’ve been doing it for a long time) since the corrupt don’t have time for the internet and won’t reach the media. If it does reach them though, it would no doubt put more resistance (or reinforcement out of hopelessness) rather than actual change. So they’re merely just trying to get the ire of the public and promoting chaos.
I give credit to your good intention and of the AP crowd though. The AP crowd have real insight and intelligence, but due to methods, the AP are easily dismissed as hecklers, paid hacks or trolls thus failing to promote their ideas.
Thank you very much, Edward. Let me say the same of you because that’s what I think you are, reading from your commentaries in all FV threads.
Edward,
I agree on all points.
I’m not really a member of the AP crowd, as I once tried to swim against the grain, and let me say, that is an experience I won’t repeat. They complain about FV editorial policies, but are rabidly totalitarian against one who thinks different than them. So their clan can be whatever it chooses to be, but I prefer a little more dignity and open mindedness, or at least the variety of mindedness that exists here at FV.
My commentary on the root source of corruption is aimed merely at getting past the first level that says corruption, itself is the problem. I am of the OPINION that the root source is deeper, and I meant no disparagement of all thing Filipino in raising that view.
I actually enjoy living here. The adventures are, if not always kind or fun, enriching.
Joe
First of all, thanks Edward for being a mediator. Between Bert and Joe. I find these two individual at their finest. (most of the times…) LOL!
These are good discussions amongst ourselves, now we are getting more acquainted with own rational thoughts. For some reasons, our frame of mind, perceived our opinion(s) in a different or irrational ways. Then, we are offended.
Are we not, to find a solutions for our own ways of living. Or, share our meaningful [ideas]ways, so we can be constructive to the solutions, as a whole.
Are the people our “ENEMY”
Or, the “GOVERNMENT” playing tricks on the people. Let us resolve this equation and find a meaninful answer for the people.
Here in California, I partake on the issue(s) that I disagree upon and, write or call to my representatives. Do Filipinos even get involve with their government to what in the hell their Congress is representing to House Committee, before even the bill gets approved.
Corruption is in everywhere in government. Atleast, we can voice our opinion(s) and, raise the flag to what we disagree upon. And, I have the sense of feeling, that I am involve with our government systems.
Question: Do Filipino’s question their “Representatives” on the issue(s)…? Or, do they whimper and whined here on FV?
Ooops!
“…acquainted with own rational thoughts…”
Correction: “…acquainted with our own rational thoughts…”
@Bert
Really? Sometimes I think I get excessive. hehe.
With all that said. I think we can all agree that generalities can provoke people and that solving the problem is not as simple as labelling or using sweeping generalizations.
@mario.
Well that’s a good practice. Personally I do not write letters to my representatives. Maybe I should try writing one sometime. Maybe you or other Pinoys overseas can do the same here too :)
Interesting point.
Zeitgeist Movement says that democracy is just a game played against the people to make an illlusion of choice. because they say that many of the government choices were not representative like how wars are decidied, bailout, healthcare etc… (I think they’re U.S. based). And if people try to protest they are met with the water cannon. I’m trying to support a candidate who says that with his cabinet, he will put civil society groups to make the people decide.
What I fear most is corruption of the spirit in our country. Most of the candidates ( specially the ones leading in surveys) are for divorce, the rh bill and the death penalty. This mind set (without God in the center) may bring us closer to countries that have abolished prayer in classrooms, allow gay marriage, pro-choice and abortion, etc. – if this is the cost of material prosperity,count me out!